The dumbest play in baseball...

[The Genius]

is sacrificing a runner to third with nobody out. It failed tonight, and it failed early in the 23-2 game. You gain virtually nothing in the probability of scoring, and you invariably choke off a potentially big inning.
The only exception is in a tie game or one run down, 8th or 9th inning. Otherwise it is just plain stupid. But that is the only "little ball" that Charlie seems to have grasped. [img]confused.gif[/img]

[Alex]

Disagree.

Runner on second, no outs...runner on third one out.

The other team either concedes the run on a ground-out, or they don't want the run to score. If they don't want the run to score, they intentionally walk the next batter to set up the possibility of a double-play.

Now you have runners on first and third, one out...and a chance for either a big inning or one run. It works for me.

[Alex]

But with a runner on third, you have so many more ways to score the runner, and you still get two trys to get a hit.

[Hawaii007]

I agree with Alex, if you are playing for one run, which is what the team wanted to do, being a run down late in the game, putting a runner on third with one out does increase the chances of scoring. If not, no one would sacrifice. All the clubs have the stats in front of them. The reason the chance of scoring increases is because from third there are over 5 more ways a person can score then from second. From 3rd there is the Wild Pitch/Pass Ball, Squeeze bunt, balk, steal, infield error, infield hit along with the ground out and sac fly. Getting any of those are much more likely from one batter along with hoping for a hit plus an infield hit or infield error plus all the other non-hitter related ways of scoring with the last hitter then three people getting a base hit. Especially with this lineup.

[The Genius]

Nope.
With a runner on second and no outs, you have 3 chances to get him in on a hit to the outfield.
If the hitters behind him average .250, the probability of getting him in is close to .750, and you don't lose an out.

[Alex]

Well, the final game against the Mets, we have runners on first and second, no outs, and Chad Allen delivers a sacrifice. Both runners are moved over.

The next batter is intentionally walked so that they can pitch to Johnny Mac.

Johnny Mac comes through with a single! (Ricky G only goes from second to third on the play) That was the start of our big five run inning.

Whenever you get a guy to third base with less than two outs, there is a chance of the intentional walk which is really a free pass for the offense.

Heck we lost by the intentional walk last night.

Perhaps the intentional walk is the dumbest play in baseball. [img]eek.gif[/img]

[The Genius]

The stupidity continues...
3rd inning, we are up 1-0. Lawton doubles and Vizquel wastes two strikes tying to bunt him over!
Why???? Let him hit! [img]eek.gif[/img]

[Alex]

Lets go over how the inning subsequently played out.

Omar DID sacrifice Lawton to third by hitting the ball to the first basemen.

Ellis Burks was up next, and probably figured he would be walked to set up the double-play (that's just my opinion) so Ellis just stood there for his five pitch at bat. Unfortunately, a funny thing happened on the way to the forum, er first base. Three of the pitches were CALLED strikes!

Thome however, was walked, again first base is open, wny not walk him? They walk Thome, and Thome's newfound protector, Milton Bradley, jacks a three run homer.

Anytime a sac leads to the next hitter or the one after getting a bases on balls, the advantage shifts to the offensive team.

[The Genius]

Omar's out was a hotshot grounder to the 1st baseman, not a sacrifice. There is a big difference between trying to hit to the right side (with the possibility of getting a base hit) and bunting to sacrifice the runner to 3rd.
I still say bunting a runner to 3rd with nobody out is a waste of an at bat unless it is the 9th and you need one run to tie or win.
N.B. If Bradley doesn't the homer, we may well have gone to the 10th tied 1-1.

[Alex]

Sounds like a sacrifice to me. He hit it to the right side. Perhaps that's better way to sacrifice than bunting, but not much.

The point is Thome was walked BECAUSE Lawton was on third.

Now the pressure increases on the pitcher to not walk another batter and load the bases for Ricky G...uh, wait a minute...why the heck did they pitch to Milton with Ricky on deck!

If were Philly fans this would be the hot topic of the night!